Go Back   AzBilliards.com > Main Category > 14.1 Pool
Reload this Page WWYD 14-1 End Pattern
Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2
 
Share Thread Tools Rate Thread
WWYD 14-1 End Pattern
Old
  (#1)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member
iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 12,839
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 21 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
WWYD 14-1 End Pattern - 10-11-2020, 02:48 PM

How would you play this end pattern?

Name:  Screen Shot 2020-10-11 at 5.38.14 PM.jpeg
Views: 135
Size:  58.3 KB

Ball on table from top of pic to bottom are: 4, 2, 13, 11, 1, 7. Every ball goes everywhere.

The outline on the table is the outside of the delta 13 rack (thin). I got through it ok and into the next rack, but I'm almost certain I played it wrong
  
Reply With Quote

Old
  (#2)
Bob Jewett
AZB Osmium Member
Bob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond reputeBob Jewett has a reputation beyond repute
 
Bob Jewett's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 19,073
vCash: 1700
iTrader: 15 / 100%
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
   
10-11-2020, 03:23 PM

The main decision is about break ball, 1, 2 , or 13. The easiest key-ball/break-ball pair is 8-13. The 13 can be a key ball for the 1 and 2.

A problem is the 7 ball since a ball there is hard to play position on unless there is a ball in the right place for it or you are OK with a long shot.

For the 13 break: 11 draw, 1 stun draw, 7, 2, 8

For the 2 ball break: 11, 1, 7, then 8, 13. From the 8 to the 13 two rails is most natural from above the ball but 1 or no rails is also possible depending on where you get from the 8.

For the 1 ball break: I'll take the long shot on the 7 to minimize cue ball movement: 11 roll forward, 7, 2, 8 13. Another consideration is that you want to get balls away from your break ball as soon as possible unless they are key balls. If I have to play the 11 from the area of the 2, I'll hit the 1.

If your speed and angle are right, you can roll the 1 in to start with and leave the 7 straight into the side. It looks close to on.

Also if your close position is working, you can play 11, roll through, 1 in the side, stun over to the right for the 7 in the lower-left corner, then 2, 8, 13 break.

The 8 is a very nice key ball for the 13 because half the table is good position for it.


Bob Jewett
SF Billiard Academy

Last edited by Bob Jewett; 10-11-2020 at 03:26 PM.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#3)
The_JV
Local_Pro
The_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 326
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Ontario, Canada
   
10-12-2020, 05:10 AM

ok so I've been playing for a about a week now so my 14.1 pattern play isn't rooted so much in experience with the game but more so best methods in playing odds with position play.

To me, the only break ball is the 2. Sure there are other options, but those are merely alternates if I happen to screw something up on my road to the 2 ball shape.

I see two "problems" in the 11 and 8 (as in things that take a moment of consideration). Unless there is a hard fast plan in play that requires a different route. I will always clear "problems" first. The 11 is in a cluster, even though easily pottable. The bigger of the two problems is the 8. It's a lousey ball to use to reach the break ball (2), and requires actual shape play to get a useful angle.

You should consider that my game is rooted in snooker, and therefore a rest (rake, bridge, crutch) is like an arm extension for me and I'm extremely comfortable with it.

Here's my pattern: roll the 8 with a minor effort to get just below the 13. The slight back cut on the 13 allows me to stun to mid table. Now the rest is a shooting gallery. If I'm sloppy with the 13 then I still have the 7 to get back in line. If I come up overly straight on the 13 then I roll through it and play either the 11 or 1 in the opposite side.

In the end, the ball I would want to hit last to reach the 2 would be the 11. Funny as that seems after saying earlier that it was a problem. From pretty much anywhere you can roll the 11 and get a good angle on the 2. The 7 is more awkward for the purpose.

The short answer... Just wing it...lol


A simple game, played by difficult people...
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#4)
sjm
Stu with the Ko brothers
sjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond repute
 
sjm's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 17,027
vCash: 525
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2003
Location: New York, NY
   
10-12-2020, 05:31 AM

I'm on board with Bob's pattern. In a vacuum, the eight may be the better break ball, but you have much simpler access to the thirteen for your break shot. Steve Mizerak was a great proponent of prioritizing simplicity of access first.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#5)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member
iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 12,839
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 21 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
10-12-2020, 07:43 AM

Thanks all for the comments. I felt flustered with this one for sure. I didn't even think of the 13 as a break ball for some reason, I was only looking at the 1 or 2 as possible break shots. Maybe I'm so used to looking a the side of the rack for break balls only. The 4 (its the 4 not the 8 at the top of the picture) does lead great to the 13. I see that now.

Here is what I did. I had paralysis by analysis and just winged it after thinking about it too long.

https://youtu.be/yt6kj4ST9_g?t=124
End pattern starts at about 2 min.

Last edited by iusedtoberich; 10-12-2020 at 07:49 AM.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#6)
The_JV
Local_Pro
The_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 326
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Ontario, Canada
   
10-12-2020, 07:56 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjm View Post
In a vacuum, the eight may be the better break ball, but you have much simpler access to the thirteen for your break shot. Steve Mizerak was a great proponent of prioritizing simplicity of access first.
Now that's interesting... I wouldn't have considered the 8 (4) as a good break ball. In my limited experience mind... That shot, assuming one long rail into the pack makes the CB a flier up table.

Coming at the pack from the bottom (13 break ball) would trap the CB to the bottom rail (aka: less options).

I figured the always preferred approach would be something along the lines of the 2 with a direct line into the side of the pack. Maximum potential for energy into the pack and fairly easy to control the CB position afterward.


A simple game, played by difficult people...
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#7)
The_JV
Local_Pro
The_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 326
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Ontario, Canada
   
10-12-2020, 08:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
Here is what I did. I had paralysis by analysis and just winged it after thinking about it too long.

https://youtu.be/yt6kj4ST9_g?t=124
End pattern starts at about 2 min.
lol... best method of course

I would have gone into the pack a ton harder on the break shot though.

Crappy miss on that 13. The balls opened up nicely and should have been another 14 balls. Hard not to let down on the "easy" one when the table sitting pretty.


A simple game, played by difficult people...
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#8)
alstl
AzB Silver Member
alstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond repute
 
alstl's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 9,092
vCash: 500
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Over the hill
   
10-12-2020, 08:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by sjm View Post
I'm on board with Bob's pattern. In a vacuum, the eight may be the better break ball, but you have much simpler access to the thirteen for your break shot. Steve Mizerak was a great proponent of prioritizing simplicity of access first.
The 8 is a better break ball than the 1, 2 or 13?
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#9)
iusedtoberich
AzB Silver Member
iusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond reputeiusedtoberich has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 12,839
vCash: 1470
iTrader: 21 / 100%
Join Date: Mar 2004
   
10-12-2020, 08:23 AM

I think sjm meant the 2.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#10)
alstl
AzB Silver Member
alstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond reputealstl has a reputation beyond repute
 
alstl's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 9,092
vCash: 500
iTrader: 6 / 100%
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Over the hill
   
10-12-2020, 08:35 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
I think sjm meant the 2.
The downside of the pattern you chose is you were straight on the 11 and would not have had to disturb the 1 if you had taken the 11 first. 13 is a good key ball for either the 2 or the 1.

My preference would have been the 2 for the break shot with 4/13 as the final balls prior.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#11)
The_JV
Local_Pro
The_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond reputeThe_JV has a reputation beyond repute
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 326
vCash: 500
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Ontario, Canada
   
10-12-2020, 08:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by alstl View Post
The downside of the pattern you chose is you were straight on the 11 and would not have had to disturb the 1 if you had taken the 11 first. 13 is a good key ball for either the 2 or the 1.
He went the path I suggested but played the 13 relatively soft. Twice as hard would have given him three options with no concern about bumping anything.


A simple game, played by difficult people...
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#12)
Island Drive
AzB Silver Member
Island Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond repute
 
Island Drive's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 8,641
vCash: 500
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
   
10-12-2020, 10:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by iusedtoberich View Post
How would you play this end pattern?

Attachment 559670

Ball on table from top of pic to bottom are: 4, 2, 13, 11, 1, 7. Every ball goes everywhere.

The outline on the table is the outside of the delta 13 rack (thin). I got through it ok and into the next rack, but I'm almost certain I played it wrong
11 roll forward below the 13, then punch it up to the 2-4-7-1


www.worldbilliardtour.com
Domain Name Only....

Bill Meacham
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#13)
sjm
Stu with the Ko brothers
sjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond repute
 
sjm's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 17,027
vCash: 525
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2003
Location: New York, NY
   
10-12-2020, 01:11 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by The_JV View Post
Now that's interesting... I wouldn't have considered the 8 (4) as a good break ball. In my limited experience mind... That shot, assuming one long rail into the pack makes the CB a flier up table.

Coming at the pack from the bottom (13 break ball) would trap the CB to the bottom rail (aka: less options).

I figured the always preferred approach would be something along the lines of the 2 with a direct line into the side of the pack. Maximum potential for energy into the pack and fairly easy to control the CB position afterward.
Sorry, I confused the eight for the two. My bad. The best break ball is the two, not the eight, but access to the thirteen is so simple that it's the best approach.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#14)
sjm
Stu with the Ko brothers
sjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond reputesjm has a reputation beyond repute
 
sjm's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 17,027
vCash: 525
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Join Date: May 2003
Location: New York, NY
   
10-12-2020, 01:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by alstl View Post
The 8 is a better break ball than the 1, 2 or 13?
I've corrected this in post 13. I mistook the two for the eight. It's the two that is best, but because access is limited, I'd play the pattern for the thirteen.
  
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#15)
Island Drive
AzB Silver Member
Island Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Drive has a reputation beyond repute
 
Island Drive's Avatar
 
Status: Offline
Posts: 8,641
vCash: 500
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
   
10-12-2020, 04:36 PM

The four to the 7 shape on the 1 gives you this. If you land on either side of the four, your position to the proper side of the 7 to the 1 is simple. Either cut it into the corner with a Huge position zone for proper shape on 1 cut coming two rails out (natural) for your/brake out angle, or if you come up short. just cut it in and play the side. Either side of the 7 will give you very good cue ball movement into shape for the 1.


www.worldbilliardtour.com
Domain Name Only....

Bill Meacham
  
Reply With Quote
Reply
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.