[dardusm]

I've been doing some instruction for the last several months. As part of my course over fundamentals, I've been using video analysis. I'm just curious if it isn't proprietary information, how other instructors use video as a learning tool. My current method is to have the student shoot 9 shots (3 stop, 3 follow, 3 draw) straight into a corner pocket. I take video from the front, side, and back of them shooting a total of 27 shots. I will then take 3 still pictures of the front, side, and back in the finish position. At the end of the course, I will then go over their video with them and point out any issues. By this time, I've covered the fundamentals and what area's to work on in their game. Should the video analysis take place before covering the fundamentals or after?

I'm always looking for ways to improve my teaching skills. Any advice from the highly experienced instructors on here would be greatly appreciated

Thanks,

Darryl

[scottjen26]

Since no one answered yet...

I can just answer based on my teaching and being on the receiving end. I think taking some video after the person has warmed up some but before receiving any instruction is best to get a solid baseline, then maybe a few shots at the end of the lesson to point out improvements and reinforce areas that need work. Multiple angles and multiple types of shots are good, although 27 shots is a bit much, could probably accomplish the same thing in under 10 shots if you think about what you are trying to gauge and vary the spin, speed, and distance of the shots.

Scott

[Scott Lee]

dardusm...Definitely before instruction. The goal should be to point out consistent and inconsistent things the student does, as part of their process. That's what the video will show. Then you help them create their own perfect process, by defining what they want that process to be (template and mantra), and showing them some exercises that will either correct stroke errors, or reinforce good habits. The 3 day school I just finished allowed the students to visually chart their progress over the three days, and grade themselves on their improvement.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Originally Posted by dardusm

I've been doing some instruction for the last several months. As part of my course over fundamentals, I've been using video analysis. I'm just curious if it isn't proprietary information, how other instructors use video as a learning tool. My current method is to have the student shoot 9 shots (3 stop, 3 follow, 3 draw) straight into a corner pocket. I take video from the front, side, and back of them shooting a total of 27 shots. I will then take 3 still pictures of the front, side, and back in the finish position. At the end of the course, I will then go over their video with them and point out any issues. By this time, I've covered the fundamentals and what area's to work on in their game. Should the video analysis take place before covering the fundamentals or after?

I'm always looking for ways to improve my teaching skills. Any advice from the highly experienced instructors on here would be greatly appreciated

Thanks,

Darryl

[dardusm]

Originally Posted by scottjen26

Since no one answered yet...

I can just answer based on my teaching and being on the receiving end. I think taking some video after the person has warmed up some but before receiving any instruction is best to get a solid baseline, then maybe a few shots at the end of the lesson to point out improvements and reinforce areas that need work. Multiple angles and multiple types of shots are good, although 27 shots is a bit much, could probably accomplish the same thing in under 10 shots if you think about what you are trying to gauge and vary the spin, speed, and distance of the shots.

Scott

Thanks for the response Scott. The 27 shots actually works out pretty well. The way that I'm working my fundamental course is for the student to play a rack of 8 ball ghost. This gives them a warmup and allows me to look at their fundamentals. Then I take the video. After the course, I go over the video and lay out a lesson plan for any area's that they might need to work on. Also, giving praise to the area's that they are strong. I like the idea of doing a video later to look at the improvements.

Originally Posted by Scott Lee

dardusm...Definitely before instruction. The goal should be to point out consistent and inconsistent things the student does, as part of their process. That's what the video will show. Then you help them create their own perfect process, by defining what they want that process to be (template and mantra), and showing them some exercises that will either correct stroke errors, or reinforce good habits. The 3 day school I just finished allowed the students to visually chart their progress over the three days, and grade themselves on their improvement.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Thanks Mr. Lee! I definitely shoot the video before the lesson so that they can see any issues. Several years ago, I videotaped myself for the first time. I had my head cocked to the side. Played like that for years and no one ever said a word. I'm left eye dominant but right handed, so I think I was subconsciously cocking my head to get my left eye sighted down the cue. I was able to make a change and straighten my head and bring the cue closer to my left eye. It helped because cocking your head can cause some visual distortion. But I played ok that way. I know of a couple of strong players that do the same thing and would guess that they are left eye dominate and right handed and still play a mean game.

Darryl

[PGHteacher]

My video analysis (that I call “the evaluation”) is an entire session and is before “day 1”. I also charge more for it than I do a lesson. My evaluation is a pretty intense and long session and is a “kickoff” so to speak. I also give them an idea of what to expect before hand. I tell them not to drink the night before (alcohol) because they are going to go through “a serious session”. I go over the whole session with them after I have had a chance to thoroughly review it myself.

I start out with a warm-up; short cuts (the OB is fairly close to the rail and CB is fairly close to the OB and have them cut the OB up table at soft, med and firm speed 3 times each), long cuts (the OB is far away from the CB and cut into the corner, again at all 3 speeds 3 times each), draw shots (the CB is on the line and the OB is in the center lined up straight, again at 3 speeds 3 times each). These are done to both sides of the table.

I then do Joe Waldrons PQ

http://www.billiards.colostate.edu/P...PQManual01.pdf

I then rack up 10 balls and tell them to break 5 times with the camera at their side view and the same with an upper view of the table about 15ft away.

The last thing is a modification of the “run an open table drill”. I spread out the 15 balls 6in away from any ball or any rail, give them ball in hand and have them try to run the low balls. If they miss they get BIH again until they sink the 8ball. I have them spot the 8 and try to run the high balls, same thing; if they miss BIH again until the table is clear. I do this 3 times 1st time no video just so they understand the drill, 2nd time from an upper view about 15ft away, 3rd time with me buzzing around them with the camera. I explain for the last one that I know they will not shoot their best because I am going to actually get in the way but some still tell me “I didn’t shoot my best there” and I say “remember what I said in the beginning?”

Why so much, so long and so intense? It is just as much about showing THEM what they can and cannot do as it is to show me. Most have no idea what they can and can’t do, most also think they can do far more than they actually can. I also tell and show them their strengths; praise is a great motivator.

Well that is what I do; I do look forward to other teacher comments and criticisms.

[FranCrimi]

While I agree that video analysis is important and beneficial, I have mixed feelings about how much and when.

This is how I gauge it for myself:

I try to be very careful not to fall into the trap of self indulgence when a player comes to me for help. I'm not a big fan of the before and after scenario --- See how much better you're doing now that you came to me for help.

I use it when I feel it's necessary, depending on the player and how they are grasping what I am showing them. If I can help a player correct a flaw by teaching them how it feels to do it correctly, then I feel I've accomplished more than any video camera can, because in the end, the player isn't watching themself play pool. They are feeling it.

Video comes in handy when the issue needs further explaining.

I don't mean to insult those who feel otherwise. This is just how I feel about it for myself.

[randyg]

Originally Posted by dardusm

I've been doing some instruction for the last several months. As part of my course over fundamentals, I've been using video analysis. I'm just curious if it isn't proprietary information, how other instructors use video as a learning tool. My current method is to have the student shoot 9 shots (3 stop, 3 follow, 3 draw) straight into a corner pocket. I take video from the front, side, and back of them shooting a total of 27 shots. I will then take 3 still pictures of the front, side, and back in the finish position. At the end of the course, I will then go over their video with them and point out any issues. By this time, I've covered the fundamentals and what area's to work on in their game. Should the video analysis take place before covering the fundamentals or after?

I'm always looking for ways to improve my teaching skills. Any advice from the highly experienced instructors on here would be greatly appreciated

Thanks,

Darryl

Hi Darryl

Interesting post. What did your Certifying Instructor teach you to do?

randyg

[dardusm]

Originally Posted by PGHteacher

My video analysis (that I call “the evaluation”) is an entire session and is before “day 1”. I also charge more for it than I do a lesson. My evaluation is a pretty intense and long session and is a “kickoff” so to speak. I also give them an idea of what to expect before hand. I tell them not to drink the night before (alcohol) because they are going to go through “a serious session”. I go over the whole session with them after I have had a chance to thoroughly review it myself.

I start out with a warm-up; short cuts (the OB is fairly close to the rail and CB is fairly close to the OB and have them cut the OB up table at soft, med and firm speed 3 times each), long cuts (the OB is far away from the CB and cut into the corner, again at all 3 speeds 3 times each), draw shots (the CB is on the line and the OB is in the center lined up straight, again at 3 speeds 3 times each). These are done to both sides of the table.

I then do Joe Waldrons PQ

http://www.billiards.colostate.edu/P...PQManual01.pdf

I then rack up 10 balls and tell them to break 5 times with the camera at their side view and the same with an upper view of the table about 15ft away.

The last thing is a modification of the “run an open table drill”. I spread out the 15 balls 6in away from any ball or any rail, give them ball in hand and have them try to run the low balls. If they miss they get BIH again until they sink the 8ball. I have them spot the 8 and try to run the high balls, same thing; if they miss BIH again until the table is clear. I do this 3 times 1st time no video just so they understand the drill, 2nd time from an upper view about 15ft away, 3rd time with me buzzing around them with the camera. I explain for the last one that I know they will not shoot their best because I am going to actually get in the way but some still tell me “I didn’t shoot my best there” and I say “remember what I said in the beginning?”

Why so much, so long and so intense? It is just as much about showing THEM what they can and cannot do as it is to show me. Most have no idea what they can and can’t do, most also think they can do far more than they actually can. I also tell and show them their strengths; praise is a great motivator.

Well that is what I do; I do look forward to other teacher comments and criticisms.

Wow, that is impressive. Thanks PGHteacher for sharing.

Originally Posted by FranCrimi

While I agree that video analysis is important and beneficial, I have mixed feelings about how much and when.

This is how I gauge it for myself:

I try to be very careful not to fall into the trap of self indulgence when a player comes to me for help. I'm not a big fan of the before and after scenario --- See how much better you're doing now that you came to me for help.

I use it when I feel it's necessary, depending on the player and how they are grasping what I am showing them. If I can help a player correct a flaw by teaching them how it feels to do it correctly, then I feel I've accomplished more than any video camera can, because in the end, the player isn't watching themself play pool. They are feeling it.

Video comes in handy when the issue needs further explaining.

I don't mean to insult those who feel otherwise. This is just how I feel about it for myself.

Thanks Fran, In my limited experience each student is different and learn in different ways. I don't think video is necessarily vital to improve but I know that in my case that seeing myself shoot was very helpful and many have never seen themselves on video. The very serious students have but at my level of experience I teach mostly beginning to intermediate players. Using APA as a guide say from a level of 2 to 6.

Originally Posted by randyg

Hi Darryl

Interesting post. What did your Certifying Instructor teach you to do?

randyg

Hi Randy.

I initially went through an BCA's Recognized Instructor training course about 12 years ago. I won't mention names but I didn't really learn that much from them but was able to certified at the Recognized level (I don't remember ever learning about using video at that time). To make a long story short, I gave lessons for awhile but didn't feel that I was giving fair value to my students and decided to shelve the instruction.

Fast forward to 2 years ago. I went and played in the US Open (bucket list tournament) and on the way back, I took some lessons from a highly respected BCA instructor. I learned a ton about teaching and my own game from him. The format, structure, fundamentals, etc. I decided to start teaching again. The format that I currently use in regards to video is loosely based on how he taught me. I am constantly re-evaluating how I do things in order to give my students value for their time and money.

Darryl